Language Log

I have a close friend who is in the habit of saying, "no, no, no; yes, yes, yes", "yes,yes,yes; no, no, no", "yes, no", "no, yes", etc., etc., usually accompanied by various, animated hand and head gestures.  There are many fine gradations of the degree to which he agrees or disagrees with you, though normally his pronouncements reflect a combination of agreement and disagreement.

What he means by these locutions depends upon the degree to which he is in agreement with you.

A couple of days ago we examined the mystifying Literary Sinitic / Classical Chinese (LS/CC) collocation 惡惡 (here).  After considering several different ways to pronounce and interpret the elements of this expression, we decided that, in most instances, it should be read wùè and be rendered as "hate evil".

Today we'll go much more slowly and deliberately through a brief classical occurrence of 惡惡 to gain a better appreciation for the meaning of the dyad 惡惡 and how to appreciate its nuances in actual use.

Here I shall quote a short passage from Lǐjì 禮記 (Record of rites) (ca. 3rd c.-1st c. BC):

Suǒwèi chéng qí yì zhě, wú zì qī yě, rú wù èchòu, rú hào hǎosè, cǐ zhī wèi zì qiān. Gù jūnzǐ bì shèn qí dú yě.

所謂誠其意者、毋自欺也。如惡惡臭、如好好色。此之謂自謙、故君子必愼其獨也。

For those who do not read Literary Sinitic / Classical Chinese, this will give you a taste:

惡惡（恶恶）

Forgive me for not telling you right away how to read these characters.  In truth, they are many different ways to pronounce them, and they all mean something different.  I will only go fairly deeply into two of the different readings and will just touch upon the others.

The first pair of characters are identical traditional forms of the same graph, the second pair are identical simplified forms of the same graph.

The strokes of the simplified form of the graph are easy to count (10), but those of the traditional form are beastly difficult to count accurately (different people count them different ways, but the standard total is supposedly 12 — go figure).

The four dots at the bottom of the character constitute the heart radical / semantophore, indicating that it has something to do with feelings / emotions, while the residual strokes at the top amount to the phonophore, giving a rough approximation of its sound.

Xi Jinping is celebrated as the first national leader of the People's Republic of China who speaks Modern Standard (MSM) rather than some heavily accented Sinitic dialect / topolect.  That is basically true, though he slurs and swallows his words, and is (in)famous for his numerous verbal gaffes (see "Selected readings" below).  Now the pseudoscience and fraud muckraker Fang Shimin / Fang Zhouzi has pointed out another alleged language error perpetrated by President / Chairman / Party Secretary of the CCP while he has been at the APEC meeting in Peru the last few days.

习主席访问了三次秘鲁，还是坚持把“秘鲁”说成密鲁，以后“秘鲁”的读音也要改了吗？央视还提醒过习主席要怎么读“秘鲁”，太大胆了。 pic.twitter.com/LtR0sGVwT3

— 方舟子 (@fangshimin) November 18, 2024

Please do not check in a dictionary or online before you try to pronounce the name just by looking at it.

When I passed through this area, it was all very confusing to me, but the local residents have no problem distinguishing the three towns.  The Dalles OR and Dallesport WA face each other across the mighty Columbia River, whereas Dallas OR is about 150 miles to the southwest.  I met one young man who was born in Dallas OR, migrated up to Dallesport WA, and crosses the bridge every day to work in The Dalles OR because he doesn't have to pay taxes in OR.  He has absolutely no difficulty differentiating the three towns and seemed surprised when I told him it was hard for me to keep their names straight.

After talking with him (and others) for several minutes, i figured out the secret for keeping the names separate, apart from the spellings.

Judging from these alarming top level official government proclamations, one might think that the Chinese language is going to hell in a handbasket, and it's all because of the deleterious effects of the internet, strict policing of which is absolutely necessary.

Rénmín wǎng: Rénmín rè píng: Jǐnfáng hēi huà làn gěng de yǐnxìng qīnshí 

Lín Fēng 2024 nián 10 yuè 13 rì 10:31 | Láiyuán: Rénmín wǎng-guāndiǎn píndào xiǎo zìhao jìnrì, zhōngyāng wǎng xìn bàn, jiàoyù bù yìnfā tōngzhī, bùshǔ kāizhǎn “qīnglǎng·guīfàn wǎngluò yǔyán wénzì shǐyòng” zhuānxiàng xíngdòng. Zhuānxiàng xíngdòng jùjiāo bùfèn wǎngzhàn píngtái zài rè sōu bǎng dān, shǒuyè shǒu píng, fāxiàn jīngxuǎn děng zhòngdiǎn huánjié chéngxiàn de yǔyán wénzì bù guīfàn, bù wénmíng xiànxiàng, zhòngdiǎn zhěngzhì wāi qǔ yīn, xíng, yì, biānzào wǎngluò hēi huà làn gěng, lànyòng yǐnhuì biǎodá děng túchū wèntí.

人民網 ：人民熱評：謹防黑話爛梗的隱性侵蝕
林 風
2024年10月13日10:31 | 來源：人民網-觀點頻道
小字號

近日，中央網信辦、教育部印發通知，部署開展“清朗·規范網絡語言文字使用”專項行動。專項行動聚焦部分網站平台在熱搜榜單、首頁首屏、發現精選等重點環節呈現的語言文字不規范、不文明現象，重點整治歪曲音、形、義，編造網絡黑話爛梗，濫用隱晦表達等突出問題。

I'll be right up front by saying that I always spell the name as "Uyghur" because doing so helps me pronounce the name more like the way the Uyghurs themselves say their ethnonym.  If I spell the name as "Uygur", it has more of a tendency to come out sounding like a slur on an American ethnic group.

"EXPLAINED: What’s the controversy over ‘Uygur’ vs ‘Uyghur’?  Beijing’s use of the former ignores Uyghurs’ preference and aims to sow division: experts" By Kurban Niyaz for RFA Uyghur (2024.09.10)

Recently, a China-based New Zealander who’s a columnist for the Shanghai Daily generated a stir when he declared on X that “Uyghur” — referring to the 12 million-strong ethnic group living in northwestern China — should be spelled in English without an “h.”

Andy Boreham, who has a history of using his social media platforms to propagate Beijing’s political messages, says the word should be spelled “Uygur,” per a Chinese government directive back in 2012.

There's a chain of about half-a-dozen fast food restaurants called Gyro Shack in Boise, Idaho, where I find myself now.  They're cool little shops, just as Boise is a cool (big-)little city spread across a broad, flat plain (nearly three thousand feet in elevation) that lies at the foothills of the Rocky Mountains.

Several things about gyros perplex me.  One is how the cones of meat on the vertical, rotating spit cohere and do not fall to pieces, but docilely hang in place oozing their mouthwatering juices waiting to be sliced off, layer after layer.  One traditional gyro meat recipe states:  "Processing the meat in the food processor and overworking it ensures that the proteins in the meat stick together, like sausage." (source)  I still don't get it, since sausage has a casing to hold it together.

Never mind about that physical matter for now,  What really bothers me (and lots of other people), is how to pronounce that four-letter word.

The oral cavity is one section of the vocal tract.  Along with the tongue, lips, and hard and soft palates, the teeth help to form different types of speech sounds.  If any one of these components is missing or deformed, it will have a pronounced (!) effect on speech production.

Two days ago, I met an older man, probably about sixty, whose teeth were highly irregular, and he was missing about half of his teeth, with gaps here and there.

It was clear to me that the man was in no way deficient in intelligence, and that he was actually knowledgeable and articulate.  Problem was, he had difficulty making all the sounds he needed to express himself.  It was also evident that he was trying to compensate for the missing vocal components of his mouth.

I departed a total of about 260 miles from my Route 30 / Lincoln Highway running route to come down to Salt Lake City for a few perduring reasons.

1. From the time I was a little boy, I have always wanted to float in the Great Salt Lake.

2. From the time I was in junior high school, I've always wanted to hear the Mormon Tabernacle Choir in person.

3. From the time I was in high school, I have always wanted to visit the world's greatest collection of genealogical records, created at great expense and effort by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints,

Below is a guest post by Corey Miller.

Azi Paybarah of the Washington Post quoted Trump as follows:

“There’s about 19 different ways of pronouncing it, right,” Trump said falsely, during a speech in Michigan on Thursday. “But Kamala is, at least it’s a name you sort of remember.”

The most interesting part of this to me is the assertion that it was a false claim. I suppose the intuition is that there are two common ways to stress Kamala, either initially/antepenultimately or medially/penultimately, so that Trump's "nineteen" is clearly hyperbolic.