War-induced language change
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For those who read Russian, with commentary for those who do not:
Грешный мой язык
«Прибалтика», «На Украине» и «Белоруссия»: теперь это моветон. А «санкционка», «рашист» и «путиноид» — новые слова. Как война изменила русский язык
13:03, 30 августа 2022 Максим Пушкарев , «Новая газета Балтия»
—–
Greshnyy moy yazyk
«Pribaltika», «Na Ukraine» i «Belorussiya»: teper' eto moveton. A «sanktsionka», «rashist» i «putinoid» — novyye slova. Kak voyna izmenila russkiy yazyk
13:03, 30 avgusta 2022 Maksim Pushkarev , «Novaya gazeta Baltiya»
—–
Sinful my tongue
"Baltic States", "In Ukraine" and "Belarus": now it's bad manners. And “sanction”, “rashist” and “putinoid” are new words. How the war changed the Russian language
13:03, August 30, 2022 Maxim Pushkarev, Novaya Gazeta Baltiya
Link to whole article in Russian
Comments by Don Keyser:
The article is entertaining on the new words in the language — mostly invective from Ukraine and supporters of Ukraine such as "putinoid" and "russcist" (for Russian fascist). In rendering "in Ukraine," the Russian use of "na Ukraine" to suggest, in contempt or dismissal, that Ukraine is but a region of Mother Russia and not a sovereign entity … and the Ukrainian insistence on the preposition v Ukraine to connote the opposite … all well known.
I had not been aware, though, that in both Pushkin and Tolstoy one finds examples of v Ukraine.
Some of the commentary on the history of spelling, capitalization, and grammar is illuminating.
Politics, war, and language — forever intimately intertwined.
Selected readings
- "What're Ukraine About?" (3/6/14)
- "Ukrainian is not Russian" (7/26/21)
- "Rusyn" (3/22/22)
- "'Little Russian'" (3/17/22) — with short bibliography on Ukrainian
- "From Rusyn / Ruthenian and Ukrainian, and on to Russian" (3/25/22)
- "Rashist" (4/15/22)
languagehat said,
September 7, 2022 @ 7:52 am
The most interesting part to me was the historical discussion of «Прибалтика» ("Pribaltika" — not, as in the misleading machine translation in the post, "Baltic States"); I have translated the meat of it below for the benefit of those who might find it of interest:
Moreover, behind the name "Pribaltika" is a concept of geographical and administrative space that developed in the Russian Empire in the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries. After Peter's conquests, territories roughly corresponding to present-day Latvia and Estonia were part of the provinces, which were called "ostzeiskie" after the German name for the Baltic Sea [Ostsee]. And under Alexander III, who insistently pursued a nationalistic policy of Russification, this expression was also Russified, and thus there appeared "pribaltiiskii region," "pribaltiiskii provinces."
Lithuania, incorporated into the empire under Catherine the Great, was not part of that group, it was included together with Belarus in another, continental space, that of the former Grand Duchy of Lithuania, and usually the Kovno, Vilna, and Grodno provinces shared a single governor-general. The Kovno province had no access to the Baltic Sea: the present Lithuanian coast belonged to the province of Courland, which ended south of Palanga, and further on it was part of Prussia.
Only in the interwar years, due to their similarities in history and situation, did Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania begin to perceive themselves as in some way a unity called the Baltic states (including in the Russian-language press of these countries) and to seek means of political and cultural convergence, which was promoted by a magazine with the characteristic title "Baltic Almanac."
In Soviet times, "Pribaltika" returned, sometimes including the Kaliningrad region. "Pribaltika" has remained in contemporary Russian discourse and is a characteristic sign of the Russian Federation's turning back to the past.
languagehat said,
September 7, 2022 @ 8:03 am
I should add that "Pribaltika" means something like 'the region adjacent to the Baltic Sea'; I don't think it's helpful to try to come up with an inevitably misleading Anglicized equivalent.
Victor Mair said,
September 7, 2022 @ 8:05 am
Thank you, hat, for your extensive discussion of «Прибалтика» ("Pribaltika"), the one term in the whole article that perplexed me most.
Artyom Barmazel said,
September 7, 2022 @ 8:39 am
> I had not been aware, though, that in both Pushkin and Tolstoy one finds examples of v Ukraine.
It must be mentioned that Ukrainian classics had used "на Україні" too: see https://uk.wikipedia.org/wiki/На_Україні#Староукраïнська and below.
Until the 21st century, it carried absolutely no hint of Russian-centrism, nor any political agenda.
Peter B. Golden said,
September 7, 2022 @ 9:50 am
The use of при (Pri-) with geographical expressions is quite standard, e.g. Причерноморье (Prichernomor'e) denoting the "Black Sea zone" – cf. also причерноморские степи (prichernomorskie stepi) the (northern) Black Sea steppes, i.e. the Pontic steppes, Приаралье (the area around the Aral Sea), Приволжский федеральный округ "the Volga Federal district" etc., Прикаспийские страны "the countries around the Caspian Sea".
Rashist stems from Rasha (the pronunciation of "Russia" in English as transcribed in Russian and Ukrainian) nicely blended with "Fascist" (фашист). Москаль (Moskal'), from "Muscovite" was a slightly pejorative term in Ukrainian and Belarusian for "Russian" – not quite as sharp as Russian Хохол (khokhol) used by Russians for Ukrainians. Like every language, Russian and Ukrainian have numerous derogatory names for ethnic others. The Soviet Union with its 126 officially recognized ethno-national identities was a breeding ground for such terms. Чучмек (chuchmek) is an all purpose derogatory term in Russian for all peoples from Central Asia and the Caucasus. That is another – and sadly – all too rich a topic.
J.W. Brewer said,
September 7, 2022 @ 12:04 pm
"Baltic States" is not, in English, a pro-Russian locution for Estonia/Latvia/Lithuania and was I believe standardly used during the Cold War by those who promoted consciousness of the fact that the U.S. had never formally recognized their conquest by and de facto incorporation into the USSR. So what's the alternative Russian word or phrase to refer to those three nations w/o the apparent baggage of Pribaltika?
David Marjanović said,
September 7, 2022 @ 1:43 pm
Or "sinful is my tongue", or just "my sinful tongue" with particular emphasis on "sinful".
Artyom Barmazel said,
September 7, 2022 @ 1:43 pm
@J.W. Brewer: the alternative designation is "страны Балтии", which is a literal translation of "Baltic States"
languagehat said,
September 7, 2022 @ 3:17 pm
"Baltic States" is not, in English, a pro-Russian locution for Estonia/Latvia/Lithuania and was I believe standardly used during the Cold War by those who promoted consciousness of the fact that the U.S. had never formally recognized their conquest by and de facto incorporation into the USSR. So what's the alternative Russian word or phrase to refer to those three nations w/o the apparent baggage of Pribaltika?
Of course it's not pro-Russian, quite the reverse, which is why that machine translation was so misleading. In Russian you can say Балтийские государства or Балтийские страны — any such expression correctly implies that the entities referred to are separate and independent countries. It's Pribaltika that has invidious implications.
DaveK said,
September 7, 2022 @ 8:58 pm
So, the English equivalent of Pribaltika would be “the Baltic region” or just “the Baltic”?
martin schwartz said,
September 7, 2022 @ 9:10 pm
In affirmation of languagehat's first remarks, my mother's
native city, Brest in Belarus (in Grodno Governate) on the border of Poland, was known the early 20th cent., when she was born, as Russ. Brest-Litovsk and equivalent names in Pol., Bel., and Lith.
and in Yiddish via the quasi-Aramaic Brisk de-Litå, all reflecting
the city'sformerly belonging, from the early 14th cent. seq., to the Grand Duchy of Lithuania.
While I'm at it, I express my recommendation that transcriptions from Russian such as "moy yazyk" above, in which y refers to 2
very different phonemes, be replaced e.g. by moj jazyk. Te matter came especially to my attention fairly recently when an invited article of mine appeared in a Russian lingusitics journal named, in its Latin-script transcription, Rodnoy Yazyk.I n bibliographies, I shall refer to it as Rodnoj Jazyk.
Sutasu said,
September 8, 2022 @ 4:14 am
"In Ucraine" does not express what "Na Ukraine" intristically is.
"Na" preposition has the sense of something being ON something. Like "the plate is on the table", "the vacuum cleaner is on the floor". But historically in Russian some lands and countries were used with "Na" preposition (partly a Polish language influence I guess) and went into the language norm.
But lots of people find that offencive, to use "na" preposition instead of a presposition used with most other county names, "v" (being literally "in", inside"). So "v Ukraine" variant is getting more and more popular.
Thus in the article I would express "На Украине" as "On Ucraine" to retain that offensive flavour, and would add a comment that "V Ukraine" = "In Ucraine" would be more acceptable.
Sutasu said,
September 8, 2022 @ 5:56 am
>moj jazyk. Te matter came especially to my attention fairly recently when an invited >article of mine appeared in a Russian lingusitics journal named, in its Latin-script >transcription, Rodnoy Yazyk.I n bibliographies, I shall refer to it as Rodnoj Jazyk.
>Martin Schwartz
In Russia the sound "Я" is usually transliterated as "Ya" or "Ia" – for example, passports and internationalized driver licences usually express names and surnames in that way.
While being a correct option with, say, Polish, in Russian "Ja" transliteration could easily be taken for "Dzha" or "Zha" type of sound.
Artyom Barmazel said,
September 8, 2022 @ 7:01 am
@Sutasu: that is simply not correct. Many Russian locations (not only geographic ones, but many of those too) are used with "на".
You can be "in" the bathroom, but "on" the kitchen; "in" the office, but "on" the factory; "in" the army, but "on" the navy; "in" Florida, but "on" Alaska; "in" Iceland, but "on" Cyprus. There's absolutely no underlying logic to be found, much like in English you can be "on a bus" or "on a plane" even though you're inside them, not on top of them.
Overall, "на" with locations is much less frequent than "в", but not at all exceptional; and apart from the 21st-century Ukrainians, nobody seems to be offended by the idiomatic choice of prepositions in Russian: neither Alaskans nor Cypriots nor others.
Artyom Barmazel said,
September 8, 2022 @ 7:17 am
@DaveK:
> So, the English equivalent of Pribaltika would be “the Baltic region” or just “the Baltic”?
I'd suggest "Balticside", copying the style of Tyneside, Merseyside, Severnside, etc.
baduin said,
September 9, 2022 @ 4:13 pm
In Polish "on – na" is associated mostly with parts of Poland or of other countries, isles and peninsulas and city quarters, and "in-w" with independent and foreign states, , eg
"na Ukrainie", "na Mazowszu", "na Rusi", "na Litwie", "na Łotwie", "na Pomorzu", "na Śląsku". "na Wołyniu", "na Węgrzech", "na Słowacji", "na Bukowinie", "na Cyprze", "na Alasce" "na Helu", "na Florydzie" "na Majorce"
but
"w Polsce", "w Rosji", "w Chinach", "w Estonii", "w Niemczech" "w Stanach" "we Włoszech",
https://kurierwilenski.lt/2013/02/14/spekulacje-nad-przyimkiem-w-litwie-czy-na-litwie/
Here is an article about conflict (in 2013) between Lithuanians and Poles in Lithuania about using the Polish phrase "na Litwie". It seems that the Ukrainian opposition is a bit similar, but more justified – there is no reason to use Polish phrases in Ukrainian.
https://www.abctlumaczenia.eu/blog/przyimki-do-i-na-w-polaczeniu-z-nazwami-geograficznymi-czyli-kiedy-jade-do-pragi-a-kiedy-na-prage/
As for Russian usage – I have no idea.
Terry Hunt said,
September 10, 2022 @ 11:45 am
It might be a 'false friend', but "Pribaltika" suggests to me a hypothetical, but as far as I know un-utilised English "Peribaltic", though this would logically encompass countries like Denmark, Germany, Sweden and Finland as well as the states on the Eastern Baltic coast.
David L. Gold said,
September 11, 2022 @ 8:09 am
To add tp Martin Schwartz's comment above:
The full Yidish name of the city now in Poland and known as Brześć Kujawski in Polish is בריק דקו (brisk deku) and the full Yidish name of the city now in Belarus and known as Brest in Belarusian is בריסק דליטא (brisk delite). When ambiguity is not foreseen, both are informally called בריסק (brisk) in Yidish.
Terry Hunt said,
September 13, 2022 @ 1:01 am
I was wrong about "Peribaltic" not being utilised in English. It is used by geologists to refer to (as far as I can discover) the Scandinavian peninsula and its immediate surrounds. However, it seems to be rare, such that I could not find a satisfactory formal definition of it, just uses in a handful of geological papers, some regarding only the "south Peribaltic area."
None of this is relevant to any putative use as a geopolitical term, of course.