"Copy editors? Who needs copy editors?" — part 325
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From Mark Swofford in Taiwan:
In sympathy with the poor sign-makers, I would have to say that the spelling of "government" is not exactly transparent, especially if we're going by how it sounds.
But wait a minute! Some dictionaries put the "n" in the pronunciation key for this word.
Most people I know pronounce "government" with the "r" but not the first "n".
Selected readings
- "Why you shouldn't use spellcheckers" (4/7/09)
- "In defense of spell-checking" (4/11/09)
Terry K. said,
July 28, 2022 @ 12:40 pm
Looks non-rhotic. Like someone remembered there's a (for them) silent R, but didn't remember where.
Nick Kaldis said,
July 28, 2022 @ 12:51 pm
Hi Mark, and thanks for posting this.
I am interested because, around 5 years or more ago, my relatives in Taipei told me that the government had a new policy of rewarding with a small cash amount anyone who found an English language error in government-issued/sponsored signs or documents –have you heard about this during your current visit?
Philip Taylor said,
July 28, 2022 @ 1:34 pm
Regarding « [m]ost people [that] I know pronounce "government" with the "r" but not the first "n"«», the LPD has this to say :
For me, the ˈɡʌv ən mənt variant (i.e., non-rhotic, with a clear first /n/) is the one that I would normally use in careful speech (an oral presentation, for example), but I may well drop the first /n/ in more casual speech, tho' I don't think that I would ever sink to the level of the two variants that the LPD classes as "casual forms" …
Andrew Usher said,
July 28, 2022 @ 5:49 pm
As the sign put the 'n' in the right place, I don't think that's the confusion. More likely, following the first comment, a non=rhotic pronunciation spelling, with the common foreign confusion of PALM and STRUT – as southern British speakers distinguish these mainly by length, those learning a British model without having phonemic length will be prone to it.
Note the LPD is careful to include the intermediate pronunciation with /mm/, which I think is my ordinary form. For non-rhotic speakers, this may not be distinctly perceived, as gov-m-ment could be derived by rule from either the geminate or non-geminate form.
k_over_hbarc at yahoo.com
John Swindle said,
July 28, 2022 @ 8:32 pm
I suppose in the US “garvenment” might result from a tendency to confuse the government with varmints.
Mark S. said,
July 28, 2022 @ 8:44 pm
@Nick Kaldis
"Visit" is a tricky word. I probably crossed the line past "visit" to Taiwan more than twenty-five years ago, though I still insist upon using the same word to describe my mother-in-law's current two-and-a-half-year stay at my apartment. (Fortunately, she's very nice.)
Regardless, if such a program of money for mistakes exists, I'd love to hear details. However small the reward for reporting errors, I could probably quit my day job.
Julian said,
July 28, 2022 @ 11:45 pm
How much of 'government' can you elide?
Here in Canberra, Australia, we live in an ex-govie house. Top that.
Benjamin E. Orsatti said,
July 29, 2022 @ 5:41 am
Saw a guy with black hat and sunglasses sitting in a white van outside a reputed mafioso’s house the other day. Worst disguised G-man I ever saw.
unekdoud said,
July 29, 2022 @ 9:54 am
In Singlish: gahmen.
Eric P Smith said,
July 29, 2022 @ 11:42 am
Here in Scotland it’s mostly [ˈɡʌvəɹˌmənt]. I might say [ˈɡʌvəɹnˌmənt] if I were being deliberately careful.
BillR said,
July 29, 2022 @ 12:33 pm
I’ve heard guvmint in rural Michigan since the 1950s.
Robot Therapist said,
July 29, 2022 @ 4:22 pm
Thanks guv!