We don't need no stinking interpreters
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Reuters' report on the trial of British mercenary Simon Mann in Equatorial Guinea for his role in a 2004 attempted coup indicates that:
Tuesday's trial was conducted in Spanish without translation… Mann… does not speak Spanish…Asked by reporters if he thought he was getting a fair trial he replied "No comment".
I'm not worried about offending the court or what passes for a government in Equatorial Guinea so I'll take the liberty of answering for him: No. A trial conducted in a language that the defendant does not understand without an interpreter cannot possibly be fair. You'd think even a tinpot dictatorship would be ashamed not to provide at least the pretense of a fair trial.
Rubrick said,
June 17, 2008 @ 8:45 pm
I think lack of shame is pretty much one of the defining characteristics of tinpot dictatorships, no?
Bill Poser said,
June 17, 2008 @ 8:52 pm
True, but they often at least pretend to be behaving themselves.
john riemann soong said,
June 17, 2008 @ 11:14 pm
What about the nation who extradited him?
Bill Poser said,
June 18, 2008 @ 1:41 am
"What about the nation who extradited him?"
Mann was extradited from Zimbabwe after serving a term in prison there. I don't know if Zimbabwe knew whether his trial would be fair or whether it would care. The courts in Zimbabwe seem to be the only part of the government trying to preserve the rule of law and decency, but I don't know how extradition works there.
Peter said,
June 18, 2008 @ 5:01 am
Mann was illegally transported by the Government of Zimbabwe to Guinea despite a Zimbabwe court ruling that he not be moved until his case against extradition could be considered. Unfortunately, this cavalier attitude to the rule of law is typical of the leaders and Government of Zimbabwe, and of state agencies there. Moreover, when brave High Court judges in Zimbabwe have in the past ruled against the Government, thugs from the ruling ZANU-PF party have physically intimidated them at their homes and offices, to the point of forcing the judges to resign. As a result, it is sadly no longer the case that most superior court judges in Zimbabwe are trying to preserve due process and the rule of law.
It may be of interest to note that the secretary-general of the main opposition party has recently been charged with treason (a charge which carries the death penalty) for publishing his party's policy manifesto!
Anthony Webster said,
June 18, 2008 @ 7:48 am
Of course, trials where individuals cannot understand the language of the court take place in the United States as well. One thinks of John Haviland's 2003 article from American Anthropologist. 105(4): 764-774.
Lester Piggot said,
June 18, 2008 @ 2:59 pm
'I think lack of shame is pretty much one of the defining characteristics of tinpot dictatorships, no?
True, but they often at least pretend to be behaving themselves.'
Well yes and no. Lack of shame certainly characterizes the United States, another tinpot country that, let's see: fudged the election of its last president, wages war against populations that can't fight back, murders its own citizens calling it 'capital punishment', and releases more CO2 into the atmosphere than the rest of the world put together.
Who are you to call Equatorial Guinea a tinpot dictatorship? Run along and pretend to behave yourselves.
WindowlessMonad said,
June 18, 2008 @ 6:51 pm
He's not a defendant at all. He's an enemy combatant. Thus, following the example of the Great Democracy, not entitled to any damned thing at all. At least he's GETTING a trial.
Atenea Acevedo said,
June 19, 2008 @ 11:11 am
"You'd think even a tinpot dictatorship would be ashamed not to provide at least the pretense of a fair trial."
I'd say you'd be quite naïve to think so. Read some history! Re-read Lester Piggot's comment!
David Marjanović said,
June 22, 2008 @ 6:28 pm
Why do you address Dr Poser in the plural? Is he the USA?
I see your point, but WindowlessMonad actually made it, not you.
Lester Pig said,
June 23, 2008 @ 6:20 am
@David Marjanović
I didn't address Bill Poser in the plural, I addressed Rubrick & Bill Poser, together, as my quotation in italics made clear.
You obviously don't see my point if you confuse it with WindowlessMonad's excellent, but quite different, point.
My point is that you don't go around calling other countries tinpot dictatorships, just because you disapprove of their governments. Bill Poser and Rubrick, regardless of their motive, are insulting the people of Equatorial Guinea.
When you write, is Poser the USA?, I think you have understood this effect youself by getting so upset: am I insulting the US government? The US nation? Poser? Yes, it gets messy if you behave that way.
Another point to be made about this post. It's really too bad that one of the very few times that the entire continent of Africa gets mentioned in the context of linguistics (I'm sure Mark Liberman could give us the exact figures) is in order to stick up for a right-wing British mercenary whose mission in life (whatever the rights and wrongs of this case) is to destablize foreign governments and kill people for money.
JBL said,
June 24, 2008 @ 4:25 pm
What is noteworthy in the case is not the fact that someone received an unfair trial. Those are common enough, as are imprisonments without trial. What's interesting is that even though they knew full well that the defendant could neither understand nor respond, they went through the show of putting it on. They went through the procedure even though they knew in this case it was completely meaningless. That's a common characteristic of governments, tinpot and otherwise.
That's setting aside the question of whether the defendant's comprehension of the proceedings would have been relevant to the outcome of the case; it's not at all clear that it would have made a difference. It's possible Mann's lawyer actually did a good job of defending him. If Mann's lawyer didn't speak Spanish, now that would be a problem. It's not that unusual for a trial to be conducted without putting the defendant on the stand. That's an entirely different matter than, say, compelling someone to sign a confession in a language they don't understand.
A (perhaps) linguistically interesting question is just what sort of message is conveyed by the process – and Mann is not the only one being sent a message.
Aaron Davies said,
June 24, 2008 @ 7:56 pm
My point is that you don't go around calling other countries tinpot dictatorships, just because you disapprove of their governments.
Um, of course you do. That's what the phrase means.
Bill Poser and Rubrick, regardless of their motive, are insulting the people of Equatorial Guinea.
Barbaric third-world hellhole would be insulting the people. I have no idea if they deserve the abuse or not, but the government clearly does.
Lester Pig said,
June 26, 2008 @ 7:02 am
@ Aaron Davies:
If you believe that 'third-world hellhole' would be an insult to the people rather than a description of, for example, a war-zone, but that 'tinpot dictatorship' is a description of a type of government, then please don't try for a career in the diplomatic service (unless, of course, it's the US's diplomatic service).