Zuckerberg 0.48 2.071 uh thanks for tuning in today
Zuckerberg 2.071 4.71 and I hope you're all staying healthy and good
Zuckerberg 4.71 10.642 um here today with doctor Anthony Fauci our nation's leading infectious disease expert
Zuckerberg 10.642 13.28 uh to discuss the recent surge in covid
Zuckerberg 13.28 15.001 across the country how
Zuckerberg 15.001 16.317 uh we can all stay safe
Zuckerberg 16.317 17.485 and improve
Zuckerberg 17.485 19.668 uh the country's trajectory going forward
Zuckerberg 19.668 20.2 SILENCE
Zuckerberg 20.2 26.903 uh doctor Fauci last joined me a couple months ago I think when- when covid was first beginning to spread in the U.S.
Zuckerberg 26.903 27.391 SILENCE
Zuckerberg 27.391 29.216 um and since then we've had
Zuckerberg 29.216 30.626 a lock down and
Zuckerberg 30.626 35.553 uh we started reopening in I think many would say maybe we started reopening a bit too quickly
Zuckerberg 35.553 37.835 before we really got it under control because
Zuckerberg 37.835 39.001 uh while
Zuckerberg 39.001 42.245 every other developed country in the world or almost every other country
Zuckerberg 42.245 43.109 um
Zuckerberg 43.109 46.301 has had a relatively smaller number of new infections
Zuckerberg 46.301 49.602 um we don't face a record number of new infections every day
Zuckerberg 49.602 52.399 uh more than fifty thousand I think daily is the-
Zuckerberg 52.399 53.968 the- the recent number and
Zuckerberg 53.968 55.792 at this point it is clear
Zuckerberg 55.792 58.327 uh that the trajectory in the U.S. is-
Zuckerberg 58.327 60.252 um is significantly worse
Zuckerberg 60.252 62.235 than- than many other countries and
Zuckerberg 62.235 65.536 uh that our government and this administration have been
Zuckerberg 65.536 69.101 uh considerably less effective in- in handling this and
Zuckerberg 69.101 69.815 um
Zuckerberg 69.815 72.502 I personally think we need to take this a lot more seriously
Zuckerberg 72.502 76.046 and our understanding of the disease of course is evolving
Zuckerberg 76.046 76.505 and
Zuckerberg 76.505 79.251 our response needs to be guided by science
Zuckerberg 79.251 80.368 and our latest
Zuckerberg 80.368 82.046 scientific understanding
Zuckerberg 82.046 84.841 um even if it's not perfect at any given moment so
Zuckerberg 84.841 86.159 I want to say up front
Zuckerberg 86.159 90.145 uh that I'm grateful for the leadership and dedication of doctor Fauci
Zuckerberg 90.145 91.75 uh who's been working
Zuckerberg 91.75 95.403 uh tirelessly under very difficult conditions to help
Zuckerberg 95.403 97.021 uh us all navigate this
Zuckerberg 97.021 98.391 uh so doctor
Zuckerberg 98.391 99.554 thank you for joining us
Zuckerberg 99.554 101.77 um and I'd love to- to get started
Zuckerberg 101.77 105.422 uh by getting your perspective on- on where things are now
Zuckerberg 105.422 107.5 uh why the U.S. response
Zuckerberg 107.5 109.278 um has been less effective
Zuckerberg 109.278 111.499 uh than- than many other developed countries
Zuckerberg 111.499 114.35 um and- and what do we do to improve from here
Zuckerberg 114.35 116.242 
Fauci 116.242 117.082 well uh
Fauci 117.082 119.55 as you described accurately Mark uh
Fauci 119.55 121.975 we- we do have a serious situation now
Fauci 121.975 124.824 I mean it's a mixed bag there are parts
Fauci 124.824 125.448 SILENCE
Fauci 125.448 130.584 of the country that are doing well uh the northeastern part particularly the new york metropolitan area
Fauci 130.584 133.888 uh was hit very hard there was a period of time
Fauci 133.888 137.64 when more than fifty percent of all the new infections
Fauci 137.64 141.088 and hospitalizations and deaths were- were right in new york city
Fauci 141.088 143.716 and there was a time when they were essentially leading
Fauci 143.716 145.136 with regard from the-
Fauci 145.136 148.298 a- a bad standpoint namely illness and- and death
Fauci 148.298 151.724 they've done very very well right now they've come back down, they're opening
Fauci 151.724 153.181 in a very measured way
Fauci 153.181 153.943 however
Fauci 153.943 155.565 as you alluded to
Fauci 155.565 157.493 simultaneous with that
Fauci 157.493 161.627 in another region of the country southern states particularly exemplified
Fauci 161.627 162.946 by Florida
Fauci 162.946 164.617 California Arizona
Fauci 164.617 165.381 Texas
Fauci 165.381 167.307 have seen surges
Fauci 167.307 169.56 that are really quite disturbing
Fauci 169.56 173.448 uh surges as you mentioned that have gone up to over sixty thousand
Fauci 173.448 174.613 cases a day
Fauci 174.613 175.075 SILENCE
Fauci 175.075 177.519 that obviously is something that we must
Fauci 177.519 178.381 address
Fauci 178.381 180.229 and address in a very very
Fauci 180.229 180.891 cogent
Fauci 180.891 181.602 way
Fauci 181.602 184.978 and if you look at the reasons for that, you ask the why
Fauci 184.978 189.471 you know why is you know it's a complicated answer to that but one of the things
Fauci 189.471 191.042 that became clear
Fauci 191.042 195.154 is that when you look and I'm not going to name any specific states but
Fauci 195.154 196.474 there were some states
Fauci 196.474 197.743 that actually
Fauci 197.743 200.54 when you look at what the guidelines were for opening
Fauci 200.54 203.285 you know the checkpoints that you have to get past
Fauci 203.285 205.112 before you went to the next phase
Fauci 205.112 206.946 some of them went too quickly
Fauci 206.946 208.828 and officially jumped over them
Fauci 208.828 211.128 That as I had said in previous
Fauci 211.128 212.094 discussions
Fauci 212.094 214.433 is a recipe for getting into trouble
Fauci 214.433 216.057 In other situations
Fauci 216.057 218.443 where the states actually officially
Fauci 218.443 220.618 the governors the mayors
Fauci 220.618 224.15 put out and delineated exactly what should be done
Fauci 224.15 225.877 but the citizenry
Fauci 225.877 228.24 of the state or the city
Fauci 228.24 231.783 had the impression that you went either for lockdown
Fauci 231.783 233 to put
Fauci 233 234.318 to put caution to the winds
Fauci 234.318 236.04 and what we saw were clips
Fauci 236.04 237.412 of people
Fauci 237.412 239.189 at bars congregating
Fauci 239.189 240.307 without masks
Fauci 240.307 241.903 not staying distant
Fauci 241.903 243.075 in crowds
Fauci 243.075 246.884 and that's what I believe is at least part of the explanation
Fauci 246.884 249.593 for why we've seen the surges went up
Fauci 249.593 251.066 that's the first thing
Fauci 251.066 254.016 the other thing that's important in the comparison
Fauci 254.016 256.296 to other countries
Fauci 256.296 260.104 which is you know in some respects unfair but in some respects
Fauci 260.104 261.289 is fair
Fauci 261.289 264.487 that when you looked at what happened in the European Countries
Fauci 264.487 266.109 when they had their peak
Fauci 266.109 268.227 and they locked down
Fauci 268.227 272.923 they locked down to the tune of about ninety to ninety five percent of the country
Fauci 272.923 274.329 truly locked down
Fauci 274.329 275.548 so they went up
Fauci 275.548 276.773 and then they came down
Fauci 276.773 277.992 to baseline
Fauci 277.992 279.662 and when I say baseline
Fauci 279.662 282.096 I mean literally handfuls
Fauci 282.096 285.04 of new cases tens twenties thirties
Fauci 285.04 287.323 not hundreds and thousands
Fauci 287.323 288.799 when if you look at the
Fauci 288.799 290.629 United States as a whole
Fauci 290.629 294.028 when we went up and peaked and started to come down
Fauci 294.028 296.364 we never really went down to baseline
Fauci 296.364 299.914 we s- we plateaued at around twenty thousand cases
Fauci 299.914 302.019 a day you really got to almost
Fauci 302.019 303.134 regroup
Fauci 303.134 304.206 call a time out
Fauci 304.206 305.476 not necessarily
Fauci 305.476 306.844 lock down again
Fauci 306.844 307.583 but say
Fauci 307.583 310.019 we've got to do this in a more measured way
Fauci 310.019 311.85 we've got to get our arms around this
Fauci 311.85 313.572 and we've got to get this controlled
Fauci 313.572 315.298 If we don't do that Mark
Fauci 315.298 317.532 we're going to wind up getting a situation
Fauci 317.532 319.304 where in other states
Fauci 319.304 320.976 we may be seeing the same thing.
Fauci 320.976 323.359 So it's a mixed bag in this country
Fauci 323.359 325.034 some areas doing well
Fauci 325.034 328.115 but some really we've got to really pay attention to
Fauci 328.115 329.329 and do something about it.
Fauci 329.329 331.78 
Zuckerberg 331.78 334.188 All right well doctor I strongly agree
Zuckerberg 334.188 335.663 uh that- that we need
Zuckerberg 335.663 337.354 somewhat of a reset here
Zuckerberg 337.354 339.414 you know as- as someone running a business um
Zuckerberg 339.414 339.909 SILENCE
Zuckerberg 339.909 340.473 you know I- I-
Zuckerberg 340.473 341.567 I've said that
Zuckerberg 341.567 348.598 uh I believe the best way to improve both public health and the economic opportunity in this country is to focus on beating this virus first and
Zuckerberg 348.598 349.512 um
Zuckerberg 349.512 351.536 I also have to say I think you- you might be
Zuckerberg 351.536 352.916 um i-
Zuckerberg 352.916 355.401 quite generous of your description of- um
Zuckerberg 355.401 357.873 of the- the government's response here uh
Zuckerberg 357.873 361.34 you know I was certainly sympathetic early on when it was clear that
Zuckerberg 361.34 363.437 uh there would be some outbreaks no matter
Zuckerberg 363.437 365.549 uh how well we handled this but
Zuckerberg 365.549 367.426 you know now that we're here in July
Zuckerberg 367.426 369.21 um I- I just think that
Zuckerberg 369.21 372.439 it- it was avoidable and- and it's really disappointing
Zuckerberg 372.439 373.302 um that
Zuckerberg 373.302 375.287 that- that we still don't have adequate testing
Zuckerberg 375.287 377.819 uh that the credibility of our top scientists
Zuckerberg 377.819 378.733 like yourself
Zuckerberg 378.733 381.118 um and the C D C are being undermined
Zuckerberg 381.118 383.007 um and until recently
Zuckerberg 383.007 383.97 uh that
Zuckerberg 383.97 389.83 parts of the administration were calling into question whether people should even follow basic best practices like wearing masks but
Zuckerberg 389.83 390.649 but look
Zuckerberg 390.649 394.962 uh the- the U S is a resilient country with a lot of ingenuity as you say and
Zuckerberg 394.962 399.884 you know we can't forget the U S is helping to lead the way on vaccine research which I want to make sure we get to in a minute
Zuckerberg 399.884 400.744 um
Zuckerberg 400.744 403.421 and I also get that our understanding of facts changes
Zuckerberg 403.421 404.844 as time goes on and
Zuckerberg 404.844 407.137 you know we all have the opportunity to reassess
Zuckerberg 407.137 410.472 uh what we've learned and change course going forward and
Zuckerberg 410.472 412.626 you know I know I try to do that personally
Zuckerberg 412.626 415.364 um and I hope that we as a country can do that now too and
Zuckerberg 415.364 417.735 I- I know that you've also face some
Zuckerberg 417.735 419.714 critique that your guidance
Zuckerberg 419.714 422.252 um has evolved as we've learned more
Zuckerberg 422.252 425.362 um so I'm- I'm hoping that you can tell us a bit more
Zuckerberg 425.362 427.912 about how your understanding of what we should do
Zuckerberg 427.912 429.225 um has evolved
Zuckerberg 429.225 432.266 and- and maybe some of the areas where- where your guidance
Zuckerberg 432.266 434.419 um for people around the country has changed
Zuckerberg 434.419 435.719 
Fauci 435.719 438.618 yeah I mean obviously when you're dealing with- with- with-
Fauci 438.618 441.316 with something that's changing in real time Mark
Fauci 441.316 443.462 that's really the nature of science
Fauci 443.462 447.629 you- you look at the data and the information you have at any given time
Fauci 447.629 452.009 and you make a decision with regard to policy based on that information
Fauci 452.009 454.443 As the information changes
Fauci 454.443 456.625 then you have to be flexible enough
Fauci 456.625 457.795 and humble enough
Fauci 457.795 460.428 to be able to change how you think about things
Fauci 460.428 463.68 and I think you know one of the important things that we're emphasizing
Fauci 463.68 465.203 right now
Fauci 465.203 467.788 that really evolved
Fauci 467.788 470.073 from a situation that did change
Fauci 470.073 472.156 is our insistence now
Fauci 472.156 473.778 on wearing masks
Fauci 473.778 474.438 I mean
Fauci 474.438 476.875 masks are very important
Fauci 476.875 478.399 they protect you
Fauci 478.399 480.839 from giving infection to someone else
Fauci 480.839 482.213 if you happen to be
Fauci 482.213 484.649 inadvertantly infected and I'll get back to that
Fauci 484.649 485.618 in a moment
Fauci 485.618 488.758 because there's such a- a significant percentage
Fauci 488.758 489.989 of the cases
Fauci 489.989 491.82 that are actually without symptoms
Fauci 491.82 494.613 so anyone at any given time could be infected
Fauci 494.613 496.949 don't even know it and feel perfectly well
Fauci 496.949 498.782 so you've got a responsibility
Fauci 498.782 501.937 SILENCE
Fauci 501.937 504.072 you can get protected now early on
Fauci 504.072 506.002 when we were in a situation
Fauci 506.002 511.689 in which there was a real concern about the lack of personal protective equipment
Fauci 511.689 514.385 on the part of the health providers
Fauci 514.385 515.398 who needed it
Fauci 515.398 518.446 who put themselves in harms way every day
Fauci 518.446 519.619 to take care of
Fauci 519.619 522.8 people who were i- ill with this virus
Fauci 522.8 526.328 that we were thinking we would run out of masks and other things for them
Fauci 526.328 528.463 so the recommendation was
Fauci 528.463 531.465 not to wear a mask because of the shortage of it
Fauci 531.465 532.383 two things
Fauci 532.383 532.992 happened
Fauci 532.992 533.856 one
Fauci 533.856 536.75 it became clear that we had enough of the equipment
Fauci 536.75 538.323 so it was no shortage
Fauci 538.323 540.913 it because clear that cloth coverings
Fauci 540.913 543.046 that you didn't have to buy in a store
Fauci 543.046 544.566 that you could make yourself
Fauci 544.566 545.786 were adequqte
Fauci 545.786 548.946 and thirdly and probably the most compelling thing
Fauci 548.946 551.385 is when it because very clear
Fauci 551.385 554.335 that anywhere from twenty to forty five percent
Fauci 554.335 556.022 of people who were infected
Fauci 556.022 557.599 didn't have any symptoms
Fauci 557.599 558.506 so
Fauci 558.506 559.515 the risk
Fauci 559.515 563.35 of your being in contact with someone who said well you look good I look good
Fauci 563.35 564.672 we're not infected
Fauci 564.672 565.939 was not the case
Fauci 565.939 568.634 that you could be spreading it asymptomatically
Fauci 568.634 570.926 you put all of those things together
Fauci 570.926 572.756 which had us evolve
Fauci 572.756 575.596 maybe we should hold off on masks because
Fauci 575.596 576.662 we needed them
Fauci 576.662 578.845 for the health care workers to saying now
Fauci 578.845 581.126 everybody should be wearing a mask
Fauci 581.126 583.415 when they're outside and should be trying to distance
Fauci 583.415 585.194 that's one example
Fauci 585.194 588.239 of evolving as you get more data
Fauci 588.239 589.866 and you get more information